[LostRacer]

Is it a bad idea to incorporate a distribution block for my grounds? For instance..in the front cabin of the car I have numerous devices that need to bee grounded. However they're regular ground wire sizes are roughly 18 gauge. If I were to incorporate a Dblock with an 8 gauge main to the car, would that be better than trying to find little places to ground all of those damned wires?

Another question, partly relevant. In my system I've installed a Pioneer DEQ-7000p DSP. Now before this installation I had minimal system noise. I mean..You could BARELY hear it. After installing this its become horrid! Its SO loud its almost unbearable. Not to mention my subs now thump upon turn on of the amps. They don't do this without the DSP installed. I'm 1/3 the way through upgrading "The BIG 3"..I know this won't solve my issue completely. However I don't want a delay relay to bandaid the problem of the "Thump" either. Any recommendations or ideas?

~Thanks

oh in case you're wondering..this is my equipment:

Pioneer DVH-p5000MP
Pioneer DEQ-7000P- Wired to deck via Fiber optic line.
Hifonics Zeus 6400ZX
Hifonics Brutus 1500D
Kicker 6.2s in front and rear
Kicker L7 12D4 x2
Stinger wiring throughout car HPM Platinum Series. All wiring including RCA's.
0 gauge from Yellow top optima to a Dblock in trunk.
4 gauge to each amp.
0 gauge ground from grounding foot to a another Dblock in trunk.
4 gauge grounds to the amps.

 

[Wolvatron]

some serious gear you have, dude!

it sounds like that once you added that new piece, it introduced one heck of a ground loop. having a ground distro might take care of the problem.

check this out though:
http://www.carstereo.com/help2/Articles.cfm?id=71

 

[LostRacer]

Is the Dblock in my trunk for my 2 amps a problem? Should I just ground them seperately? Even though I wasn't having a problem before the DSP was installed?

 

[Wolvatron]

if you weren't having the problem before the DSP then it probably isn't a problem at all. there also could be a bad ground with the unit itself. a bit unlikely, but i guess it could happen. *shrugs*

 

[LostRacer]

Originally posted by: Wolvatron
if you weren't having the problem before the DSP then it probably isn't a problem at all. there also could be a bad ground with the unit itself. a bit unlikely, but i guess it could happen. *shrugs*

So with that in mind...(bad ground) if I were to say mount the unit to the chassis of the car or run another ground fromt he chassis of the unit..could that POSSIBLY clear it up?

 

[Moraki]

If all else fails ill show you how to Cadweld your grounds

 

[LostRacer]

:biggrin:

 

[tad]

why not just run a ground to the actual battery and hook a dblock up to that?
what's the big deal of a 1/2 second delay to get rid of the thump?
i have a device that mtx makes.. it's a bass booster and also a delay relay combined into one
they call it the black box.. lsb1

 

[LostRacer]

you want your grounds to be as short as possible. Running it back to the battery gives it more chance to pic up noise. I believe thats what the argument was..Where as grounding directly to the chassis with shorter wire is more effecient..as long as you're grounded well under the hood.

As far as the 1/2 second is concerned..I'd like to rectify the issue instead of covering it up If I can't do that..well then I'll consider that other option

 

[Moraki]

Thats one that i dont understand, there is no true ground on a car (the charge is asorbed by the battery not the actual ground). Therefor why does it matter if the charge travels along the chassis or a wire?

 

[bgred619]

everything is grounded to chassis not battery, and lost your right you want the grounds as short as you can. if it started after installing eq wich where alot of noise starts, try changing grounds and run power wire away from rca's.


need more help to isolate check this thread out....
http://forum.sounddomain.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=008251

 

[LostRacer]

Thanks Justin..Yeah..I've been poppin in and out of SD reading. I'm aware of the power and RCA issue. Its just really satarting to bug me now..I'm going to try to finish the BIG 3 this weekend..hopefully that will make some difference. Maybe I'll see If I can find out if anyone else was having this issue with this model.

 

[Moraki]

Umm i hate to brake it to you but yes it is the Battery taking up the charge.... do you have some sorta delusion that the charge goes into the chassis and what magicaly disapates? :rofl:

The battery ground is ACTUALY taking up the charge from the chassis. Else you would get a static shock every time you touched your car and filling up at the gas station would be 1000 times more dangerous.

So anyway the charge is returning to your battery i dont see why it matters if its Via wire or chassis....

 

[mallard]

Grab a sensitive ohm meter. Measure resistance between the negative terminal (on each piece of your equipment) and some unpainted metal on the car near where that ground wire is connected. The number should be negligible in every case. Anybody have a good reference number for how much resistance is acceptible?

 

[Moraki]

Ya here ya go read your own link ....

An important thing to keep in mind is that not all metal in a vehicle is electrically connected to the chassis. The frame or subframe is probably isolated from the chassis with rubber grommets and the connecting bolts may not be touching bare metal. The goal here is to ground everything back to the chassis using ground points of equal (or to within .25 ohms) resistance. If you are unsure of the resistance of a grounding point you can pre-test your grounds using a multi meter. Ideally you are looking for net values of less than 0.3 ohms. Use the battery negative as a reference and start by using a wire (any size will do) that is long enough to reach from the battery to the spot you want to test. Set your multi meter to ohms and measure the resistance of the piece of wire from end to end. Connect one end of the wire to the negative terminal of the battery and the other end to one of the probes on your meter. Use the other post of the meter to test potential grounding spots and write down the ohm readings of each spot. Subtract from that reading the resistance of the wire you previously measured and use the spot with the lowest resistance. You can check several spots and only ground in locations that are within .25ohms of each other if you have to use multiple grounding locations.

This guy is showing you how to test how well a grounding spot RETURNS THE CHARGE TO THE BATTERY.

 

[LostRacer]

Originally posted by: Moraki
The battery ground is ACTUALY taking up the charge from the chassis.

This is absolutely correct. And this is one reason why they recommend the Big 3 upgrade. :thumbsup:

Else you would get a static shock every time you touched your car and filling up at the gas station would be 1000 times more dangerous.

This is a myth...Saw it on Myth busters :tongue:

So anyway the charge is returning to your battery I dont see why it matters if its Via wire or chassis....

The longer run of wire the more noise can be induced. Thats why they say to run as short of ground as possible.

They also mention if you have an immense amount of rca left over not to coil it up..it will induce noise as well.

Thanks for the help guys. I will be cheking my ground resistance this weekend. mainly on my sh!tty dsp.

 

[Moraki]

By the way thats not as much of a myth as mythbusters made it out to be.... i saw a site argueing against them.... exspecialy in light of the number of gas stations lighting of fire now days is on a major rise.

One instresting fact they posted .... a young fit person is more likely to have a gas station fire. Why you might ask? A young fit person jumps out of the car and doesnt touch the body at all. An older or out of shape person will grab or touch the body at some point and discharge it. Static can and HAS blown up gas stations. Thats the same reason if your going to fill up your gas, for like your lawn mower, your supposed to put it on the ground 1st then fill it up. Setting it on the ground discharges it.

 

[LostRacer]

:kick: Oldman!

 

[bgred619]

Thats not what i meant moraki, i know it completes the circuit basic dc theory...

What i meant that everything doesnt connect directly to battery, but instead runs through the chassis..

 

[Moraki]

ya i know but thats my whole question ....why does it matter ?

Indirect or direct connection to the battery should be the same in theory but everyone recommends against it?

Is that just to save money and weight or is there some real reason?

Does the flat steel of the body / chassis not pick up RF interference like a copper wire would?

Ive just always wondered because it would seem the wire would be better. Grounds to the body are inherently bad, they shake loose and corrode (dissimilar metals). Theres a big reason they don't make steel wire for electric, it SUCKS for that.