[Instigator]

Started tonight after work after finally getting my pistons back from getting fixed at Ross (skirt was waaaaaay to long)

Ross 8.5:1 Compression Piston w/ stock 03 con rod (I know I know should gone Pauter but I ran out of $$$ )

Pistons/rods installed with Clevite Main and Rod Bearings.........2 hour process involving a very crappy AutoZone piston ring compressor :disgust:

Installed Oil Pump

Installed updated tray and pick-up tube

Installed mount and crankcase vent

Installed Copper Head Gasket by GasketWorks of California

ARP Head Studs and tech instructions

Installed my PnP heads from Dover Cylinder Head Service (more pics in a prev. thread)

And thats that for tonight. I start school tomorrow, so i will continue after that and when i get off of work. Shoud have the cams in and have her timed by the end of tomorrow night. Full time school and full time job are holding me back :disgust:

More pics to come..................

 

[DEVIOUSDEV]

Sweeeeet :thumbsup: I'm jealous... a semi assembled engine

You made sure to torque the ARPs to their proprietary specifications, and not the torque specs in the Ford manual right?

And out of curiosity, why did you go with the copper head gaskets?

 

[DanG]

Got another question- Those cylinder walls don't even look honed let alone bored... Maybe it's a bad picture, but I still see discoloration at the top of the bore around where you'd see combustion remnants... :ugh:

New rings + old cylinder walls =

 

[FastCougar]

Originally posted by: DanG
Got another question- Those cylinder walls don't even look honed let alone bored... Maybe it's a bad picture, but I still see discoloration at the top of the bore around where you'd see combustion remnants... :ugh:

New rings + old cylinder walls =

I was thinking the same thing ... good thing you got those ARP head studs

Not to mention rebalancing the crank ... forged rods = more mass = more weight = out of balance crank :crazy:

 

[PuckPuck]

Originally posted by: FastCougar

Originally posted by: DanG
Got another question- Those cylinder walls don't even look honed let alone bored... Maybe it's a bad picture, but I still see discoloration at the top of the bore around where you'd see combustion remnants... :ugh:

New rings + old cylinder walls =

I was thinking the same thing ... good thing you got those ARP head studs

Not to mention rebalancing the crank ... forged rods = more mass = more weight = out of balance crank :crazy:

triple that... new rings need honed cylinder walls.... also i would of expected the block surface to be cleaner... then again whenever i pull a block out the first thing i do is get it hot tanked, so all that gunk goes away quickly....

 

[DanG]

Consensus- You're in bad trouble, Instigator. That thing's not going to work for long the way it is... Rings won't ever seat properly, you'll start burning oil, pressurizing the crankcase under boost, and blowing out seals... That is, if the head gasket holds with all that contamination on the deck... :cover:

 

[DEVIOUSDEV]

Originally posted by: FastCougar

I was thinking the same thing ... good thing you got those ARP head studs

Not to mention rebalancing the crank ... forged rods = more mass = more weight = out of balance crank :crazy:

He's using stock rods

But yeah, apparently my shop had quite the time balancing my crankshaft with the pauter rods (not that I fully believe anything they say ) so those pauter's are quite the hefty lil sumnabiches

 

[FastCougar]

I mean to say forged pistons ... either way, any component that is not the same weight/balance as stock will require a rebalance.

 

[Topik]

hey look its the mount from Gnulocos engine. w00t

 

[Instigator]

do you guys wanna see pictures of me taking everything apart?

what is used to hone the cylinder walls?

EDIT: and also, the deck isnt mucked, i took the picture of the gasket on after it was cleaned

 

[DanG]

Stop your work and step away from the engine, man. You're going to waste a LOT of money QUICKLY at this rate.

When I said that this project costs $15k to do it right, I meant it. The cylinders must be honed, if not bored (depends on the piston and ring size) to tolerances of only a few thousanths of an inch (.001"). That's not something you can do by yourself unless you have a lot of equipment and very precise measuring equipment (and no, a digital caliper doesn't count!). Cylinder hones are basically stones and smooth out any imperfections in the cylinder walls- They give the rings a place to seat themselves instead of having to conform to the old rings' patterns, which will cause seat/sealing failures and possibly lead to complete ring failure.

Also, the entire rotating assembly (crank, rods, pistons, flywheel, pressure plate, and damper) must all be balanced - Precision here is a MUST as well, or the crank will start walking around in the journals and possibly lead to bearing failure. Weight needs to be added (just as you balance a tire on a rim) to ensure it's not heavier on one side than the other. If you have forged rods as well, even MORE weight needs to be added:

See the weight actually sitting in the crank? The thing had to be drilled out, and a "heavy" had to be added- It's probably some sort of lead... Or uranium...

There are also contaminants ALL over the front of that motor. You're in serious trouble if all that crap is floating around the engine when you first start it. The oil pump looks like you've rolled it around in sand before installing it- Look at your tolerances again- .001" is not going to seat well with a piece of debris measuring 10 times that width...

If you don't know these things- If you don't have the background- Have a shop do it! For example, Trevor and I both had our shortblocks cleaned, balanced, and assembled at a machine shop. This costed us each $980.77, balancing alone was $380 of that!

Don't screw this up, man- You've stretched yourself way too thin on this project, and you WILL regret it if you mess up now.

 

[Livinsvt]

Jebus man what are you doing. Get than thing to a machine shop and have them dissasmble it and clean it than thing. Not to mention the honing. I see no cross hatch left in the walls. Doesn't appear that you have dissasmbled the oil pump and cleaned it either. Do these things, or disaster is in your future.

About how much were those gaskets? Just curious, I ak thinking around $3-400. I would considered haveing the block machined for o-rings if you uses them. They can some times be bit tricky to get to seal right, but you may be fine.

Oh and its mallory they use to balance a crank with and you should have some at this point in yours. Do this!

 

[timeless420]

Defintely get that thing balanced. I had my whole assembly balanced (rods/pistons/crank/PP/clutch/flywheel/damper....pretty much anything that rotates) Turns out my pistons were actually lighter than the stockers (FI piston vs a NA piston) and material had to removed, not added to the crank. It is well worth the $$ you spend as well as you will never have an engine as smooth. I got lucky as I had everything balanced for <$350 CAD (the guy at the shop is a long time friend of a good buddy). With pistons you can get away with them being out a small amount (<5grams) since they are not trulyr eciprocating like the crank and rods. Even look at the varaince allowed for stock pistons and consider the weight added from the build-up of carbon on the tops over the life of the engine, but anymore than that you need a rebalance.

 

[Instigator]

trust me guys i have realized the mistake i was about to make, i have everything disassembled now, and im off to a local machine shop on thursday, tho i have no idea on how im going to pay them :slap:

thank you all, good lookin out

 

[PuckPuck]

get the engine block and all used engine parts hot tanked... that's where they dip it into some funky kind of acid or something.... after a short bath when the parts come out they are all clean and shiny...

also get the cylinder walls honed.... or like we call it around here "Monkey Balled".... it's called monkey balled, because the tool you use is also refered to as "Monkey Balls"... it's kinda like what Dang said... a bunch of small balls, mounted onto something that looks like a pipe cleaner... they put it in a drill, stuff it into the cylinder hole, and start it up... it's essentially like taking 0.001" off the cylinder wall surface....

it shouldn't cost much.... as no real "machining" work is required... the honing procedure shouldn't take more than a few minutes per cylinder.....


btw: i honed 3 of my own cylinders just cause i wanted to... that's how easy it is with the tool.....

 

[Livinsvt]

I hear an echo.....

"monkey balls" don't work really that well. They can get you buy. Honing at a machine shop is the best way.

Oh and $380 for balancing is expensive, even for Pauter rods. I would think his crank would be in the $100 range. Shouldn't be much to do.

 

[GrandMasterKhan]

:drama:

This is the stuff I am worried about when I start my build! I am not sure if there are places trustworthy enough my area to do that kind of work.

but at least now i know what to look for.

 

[IUPcoug00]

This may be a 3L newb question. but the honing and balancing only needs to be done if you replace the pistons, crank, etc. A normal hybrid swap wouldnt need all this, right? I'm just trying to gather as much info as possible before i start buying parts.

 

[DanG]

Only if you replace the rings or otherwise remove the pistons from the cylinders. If you remove 'em, you need new rings and honing. Balancing is "a good idea" also if you pull and replace anything.