PRP Tables To Change to make Non-SVT a SVT?

[FastCougar]

Does anyone (Warmonger/DemonSVT) know exactly what tables and values need to be changed in order to make a non SVT ECU mimic an SVT ECU? As you know, I totaled the Contour in a rollover. The accident only affected the outer shell and all the machanical system seam fine. I plan on pulling the engine/trans and fitting into the Cougar, which is currently engine/transmission-less. Problem is that the Cougar ECU is stock and 3L + SVT cams = runs like crap on stock ECU. Any help would be greatly appreciated and most likely compensated. PM me if you can help! Thanks!!!

[RodneyBur]

A little info I used on my build that me be helpful to you. Hopefully it helps.

http://www.contour.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=3L&Number=1243828&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=all&vc=1

And from a thread I had on CEG
For me, I took the stock values for Spark from the SVT program. That was the biggest thing.

TP for WOT was also an issue with the standard duratec ECU. If you are using an SVT TPS you should look at that in the tune if you can, or mention it to your tuner.

I'm sure there is more that I can think of, but if you have any more questions about this I will be happy to answer as I have done a lot of the trouble shooting in this area already.

[warmonger]

Yes, I gave the spark tables from my SFG2 code to Mapoftazi to input into his own PRP. I don't think they would do a lot of good without the SVT cams because the spark timing is usually experimentally determined through testing.
More clearly put, the cams allow the engine to breath air in a characteristic way, which directly influences the knock characteristics of the engine, which directly affect the timing that the engine is able to hold.

Since the only difference between SE/SVT engines is the cams, injectors, timing, airflow, compression, it stands to reason that these influence each other.
THe SE is lower compression so it could handle more timing...but it doesn't breath as well at high rpm so it may NOT take as much in higher rpms.

So if you bought SVT hardware then I would surely jump up and throw in the SVT timing parameters as a starting point. If not, then I'd just tune up from the stock SE tables.
And when I say SE tables I mean the cougars as well. ;)

[TrackCat]

Cams increase your VE into the engine. What did you mean knock characteristics??? I've never heard that before.

[fordrule]

hopefully the xcal2 i get has that already done to it. i am going to get the prp later.

[warmonger]

Cams increase your VE into the engine. What did you mean knock characteristics??? I've never heard that before.

Just what I said. Resistance to knock/detonation is as much a product of combustion chamber design as it is fuel octane rating. The combustion chamber shapes the airflow in and out as well as the way the charge burns after ignition. Low or static flow causes pockets that will get hot enough to light off on their own causing ping/knock rather than smooth burn. Cams are usually optimized for certain rpm ranges and in those ranges the engine can tolerate more. Outside of those ranges the engine is more susceptible to knock.

To prove this point simply look at what happens when you are trying to climb a hill in too high of a gear at too low of an rpm. The rpm and therefore airflow is low but the load on the engine is high meaning that max fuel is being added. The combustion chambers are already hot. If you downshift and put the rpm range higher to say, 5000rpm, the engine runs smooth as silk. The airflow is more optimal at that rpm due to the cams and other factors. So lets say though that you don't downshift and try to climb at lower rpm where the cams are not optimized. What do you get?? Lugging, pinging, and in some cases knock.
The engines of today run around with compression ratios between 10-11:1 on 87 octane. In the 80s this was unheard of. The passenger car/truck engines maybe ran 9:1 and the high performance engines might have ran 10 to 10.5:1. Sure the fuels may have been improved a bit but 87 octane is 87 octane. The biggest improvements have been in more accurate metering and mixing of fuel and in the characteristics of the airflow going in, the burn, and exhaust out of the engine. These all affect knock rating without any change in fuel octane.

So to summarize, the cams are an integral part of this. :biggrin:

[FastCougar]

Yes, I gave the spark tables from my SFG2 code to Mapoftazi to input into his own PRP. I don't think they would do a lot of good without the SVT cams because the spark timing is usually experimentally determined through testing.
More clearly put, the cams allow the engine to breath air in a characteristic way, which directly influences the knock characteristics of the engine, which directly affect the timing that the engine is able to hold.

Since the only difference between SE/SVT engines is the cams, injectors, timing, airflow, compression, it stands to reason that these influence each other.
THe SE is lower compression so it could handle more timing...but it doesn't breath as well at high rpm so it may NOT take as much in higher rpms.

So if you bought SVT hardware then I would surely jump up and throw in the SVT timing parameters as a starting point. If not, then I'd just tune up from the stock SE tables.
And when I say SE tables I mean the cougars as well. ;)You of all people should know that my 3L build involved SVT cams ... not to mention I stated in the opening post fo this thread "3L + SVT cams ..."

Need a vacation? :rofl:

[warmonger]

Hey now, watch your tongue. :tongue:

I was on my soapbox there and speaking more or less rhetorically on the thinking behind using the timing tables with the cams. I can still read. lol

[ilovemycar]

Yes, I gave the spark tables from my SFG2 code to Mapoftazi to input into his own PRP.


Sooo...could i get those? :)

[warmonger]

Sooo...could i get those? :)

Sure, I could give the max allowed table in spreadsheet form if you wish.

[ilovemycar]

Sure, I could give the max allowed table in spreadsheet form if you wish.


My e-mail is uscin2003@hotmail.com if you wanna mail 'em to me...:)

[warmonger]

I sent them. Did you get them?

[ilovemycar]

I sent them. Did you get them?

Yup i got them...thanks. They will be helpfull in a couple months ;)

:biggrin:

[fordrule]

can i get them also please or can they get posted on here. might be a good add

[RodneyBur]

Can you open that as some sort of office document and be able to view the tables?

[warmonger]

ask Ilovemycar for them. I've already mailed them out several times.

I already did the hard work. They are in excel and you can cut and paste them into your PRP. I should be charging for that crap... :biggrin:

[fordrule]

but tom ur pimp like that

[RodneyBur]

it also looks better for the signature:

3.0L, SCT Chip with Warmonger SVT Tables, etc, etc

3.0L, SCT Chip with Ilovemycar SVT Tables, etc, etc :confused:

[ilovemycar]

it also looks better for the signature:

3.0L, SCT Chip with Warmonger SVT Tables, etc, etc

3.0L, SCT Chip with Ilovemycar SVT Tables, etc, etc :confused:

Oh ok i see how it is. Just remember...Of me and Tom i have the "quicker" Duratec with my 13.2 run...with a 2.5 mind you. :rofl:

Just messin' with ya Tom ;) (even tho it's true)

Joey...what's your e-mail?

[warmonger]

Yeah even though I never once could hook-up in 1st or 2nd gear on mine... lol

[ilovemycar]

Yeah even though I never once could hook-up in 1st or 2nd gear on mine... lol

Me either thats why i bought the drag radials.

[warmonger]

So see, I've got most people with my runs just on stock width street tires and pretty much only the cars with DRs could beat me.

[fordrule]

josephsites42@yahoo.com