Looking to get 3.0L for 99 ATX

[Nafunu32]

I was thinking of upgrading to it. About how much would it cost me to get the car completely up and running? What all do I need, other than just the 3.0 block? From factory 2.5 to factory 3.0, about how much extra HP am I looking to gain? I'm new to the cougar world.

[jrak123]

It's not too bad of a job if you know what you are doing, depending on how far you want to go it can cost anywhere from $800-5000 You just have to decide on what you want. Where do ya live. I am now set up in a garage with a hoist and can do a streight 3l swap in about 2.5 days.

[BigBalledOX]

I was thinking of upgrading to it. About how much would it cost me to get the car completely up and running? What all do I need, other than just the 3.0 block? From factory 2.5 to factory 3.0, about how much extra HP am I looking to gain? I'm new to the cougar world.

The simplest bang for your buck swap would be a hybrid, using a 3L block and 2.5L heads, which will bump the compression up and hence raise your horsepower. However, there are a myriad of options that can significantly increase the performance out of the 3L. It depends on how much money you wanna spend.

[XplosivePlushToy]

Money not a factor, what set up provides the most hp? I remember reading something along the lines of the 3.0L block, SVT heads and cams with oval porting.

[jrak123]

Money not a factor, what set up provides the most hp? I remember reading something along the lines of the 3.0L block, SVT heads and cams with oval porting.
Certainly the best option for a N/A engine. The one I did was 3L 3L heads and porting work for the SVT UIM/LIM made 220 at the wheels and still needed tuning and that was before the exhaust and Mustang Throttle body and a few other goodies.

[DemonSVT]

The simplest bang for your buck swap would be a hybrid, using a 3L block and 2.5L heads, which will bump the compression up and hence raise your horsepower. However, there are a myriad of options that can significantly increase the performance out of the 3L. It depends on how much money you wanna spend.
Also the worst choice for reliability since it retains the 2.5L's worst flaw. The utter lack of rear oil drains. :banghead:

Then when you consider that bone stock oval swaps have made as much or more power the a comparable hybrid you wonder why anybody even thinks about building a hybrid in the first place.

An oval port 3L is your best option.

[Nafunu32]

I live is east Texas. I can get a motor from a 2000 Ford Taurus for 800. Has low miles. Its from a wrecked car, so I really dont know the specs on it.

[BigBalledOX]

Also the worst choice for reliability since it retains the 2.5L's worst flaw. The utter lack of rear oil drains. :banghead:

Then when you consider that bone stock oval swaps have made as much or more power the a comparable hybrid you wonder why anybody even thinks about building a hybrid in the first place.

An oval port 3L is your best option.

Not arguing about that, but if he's looking to do it on the cheap, I'm pretty sure I'm right. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

[fordrule]

u need to go read the FAQ at the top of this section. i would strongly suggest a 01 or later 3L. lower miles and u dont have to run an elkectric water pump. go for a 01-02 sable/taurus/escape motor. 03-04 motor less miels and a little bit more expensieve

i bought my engine from a yard for 500 it was a 02 sable w/ 32k on it

[Nafunu32]

Found one from an 01 Sable... 850.... from a junk yard. Is this where everyone gets theres from? Less than 100k motor... including heads and all.

[Bigoudi]

Less than 100k miles??? Whats that all about? :confused:

Greg

[Nafunu32]

What do you mean Big?

[Bigoudi]

Can't they tell you an actual number of miles, instead of "less than" 100k?

Greg

[RodneyBur]

I paid $180 for an 02 sable engine with 47k miles. Ebay auction with buy it now from LKQ dismantlers. They have cheap engines all the time. I would check them out before calling around local junkyards.

And buying the engine itself seems to be the cheapest part of this build. All the other parts needed is what really starts to add up. Go for a straight 3.0 swap if you want to go cheap. You should be able to do that for less than $1500. This includes some tranny work and other updated items. (LSD, OIL PAN, SHIFT TOWERS, ETC)

I also noticed that you are have an auto so set aside about 5k for a manual swap too.

A oval to split port swap would add at least another $1500 on top of that if you have someone else do the heads for you. Thats if you use your stock parts for the swap. (1200 for heads and 300 for gaskets)

If you want even more power and plan on using SVT Goodies (UIM, CAMS, TB, etc ) add another 800 or so for buying the parts.

Something always seems to go wrong so set at least 500 aside for other reasons.

Oh and if you are not doing this yourself and are paying someone else to do it add another 2000 or so.


First, you need to sit down and read some some of the past swaps and info to get knowledgeable on the swap. If you can't do it yourself then you must find someone trustworthy enough to do it.

[recliner15]

why would he need to get a swap

[Nafunu32]

I would love to just do a lot of work on my 2.5l. Are there a lot of parts out there for it? I'm a freshman in college working 25 hours a week making 7.50 an hour. I don't really make a lot of money.

[BigBalledOX]

I would love to just do a lot of work on my 2.5l. Are there a lot of parts out there for it? I'm a freshman in college working 25 hours a week making 7.50 an hour. I don't really make a lot of money.

I'm going to be brutally honest, and don't take it as anything against you, but there's not a lot of parts available for it, and the kind of budget you're operating with isn't helping matters either. You could probably go I/H/E, the basic bolt ons, for $1200-$1500 for the good stuff.

[Frosty]

Also having an ATX does not help at all if your really looking into major performance mods. You have more options with an MTX.

[Nafunu32]

Are MTX conversions available for the car? If so how hard and expensive are they? It's a car I would love to have as a MTX...plan on keeping it for a while

[nadthomas]

$850 seems a little high if the milage is anywhere close to 100k. Unless you plan to tear down and rebuild, I would recommend something atleast under 50k miles, and preferably under 30k.

Also, after doing a straight 2.5L to 2.5L in my cougar this past summer, I would recommend contacting Blackcoug and just have him drop a 3.0L in for you. For me to replace the engine, my final total came in around $2300 doing the labor myself. Blackcoug will do a 3.0L for $3k including all parts and labor, had I known that then I would have taken it to him.

[Nafunu32]

I found a motor online for 450 including shipping... It says I need stater, compressor, and alternator to be up and running. 01 Taurus motor...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2001-FORD-TAURUS-COMPLETE-ENGINE-MOTOR-6-CYL-3-0L_W0QQitemZ8024079546QQcategoryZ33615QQssPageName ZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Is it worth getting? Would the parts needed be used from my current 2.5?

[recliner15]

Also having an ATX does not help at all if your really looking into major performance mods. You have more options with an MTX.

the only difference ive seen is the availability of turbo/superchargers

along with short shifters and tranny stuff.. but thats it

[fordrule]

what are doing as plans, just to have a 3.0L or for performance?

yes the price of that engine is good i paid 500 for mine and it had 32k miles on it

[Nafunu32]

I came upon a decent deal... my roommates mom just totalled out her 1999 ford taurus. She said I could have the motor (110k miles) for the fee of getting the car out of the wreckage company lot. They charge 20 bucks a day so when I get paid it will be up to about 200 bucks. Would it be cheaper to get the car for 150-200 bucks, rebuild the motor and put in, or to just buy one stock with less than 50k miles for 500? Also, about how much do shops charge to do motor swaps? I do not have much knowledge in this field.

[Blackcoog]

Apparently you didn't listen to people's posts. They said 2001+ not a 1999. The 99's didn't have the cam driven water pump so you'd need to get an electric water pump. The 99's are also split ports and use aluminum intake manifolds. You could do it for a more money but I'd stick with a 01+. It will be more expensive to go with that 99 in the long run then it would to get a 01+ 3L engine.

[tr0nic]

The man knows what he is talking about... he has done 9 of these swaps so far. Props to Blackcoog for the experience!

[Afroman]

Nafunu32 clearly you are not reading the posts and listening to the advice. That’s one of my pet peeves on this board. People take the time to give good honest advice and then the person who asked for the advice doesn’t listen.

One thing I have learned is there are two ways to do a project.

1.) The cheap way ( which will result in you having repair your mistakes later actually costing you more money)

2.) The right way (once you close your hood, your car runs great and you never have to worry)

What’s the point of sticking an incorrect motor with over 100K miles in your car just so can save maybe $300. Wise up and realize an engine swap is a detailed process that requires a lot of planning BEFORE YOU DO THE SWAP.

Best of luck and please take the advice of the very skilled and knowledgeable people who have posted before me.

[Afroman]

By the way on a side note, no one has asked when in 99 your car was made.

Make sure you know if your car is a Return or Returnless style car.

Return: Made before 5/99

Returnless: Made after 5/99

Take look under the hood if made on 5/99

[Nafunu32]

It's a return. I do read, and I know there would have to be an electric pump. I know very little about these motors and wasn't sure if it would save me money or not. Just coming up with different things I can do. Getting you guys to give input about it.

edit: Where would be the best place to find an 01+ motor? Ebay? Found one for 350 +125 shipped but has 75k miles on it.

[fordrule]

LKQ u might be able to find a place close to u

link to lkq (http://www.lkqcorp.com/location/fSearch.asp?L=15)

[recliner15]

car-part.com

[Nafunu32]

Found a motor close to me for 500 bucks... only 1k miles on it. 01 Ford Taurus... does that sound right?

[Afroman]

If he has a return style set up... would he just bolt his current LIM and fuel rail to the new motor he is buying? Since all the recommended engines (5/99 and up) are returnless.

[Nafunu32]

My car was made in 3/99... will that affect anything?

[Blackcoog]

You do know this isn't a straight drop in engine right. You have to modify quite a few things and you need to pay for a $1000 head porting to keep the stock intake connections. Otherwise if you go with the complete 3L and stick with the 3L upper you need to make a custom fuel rail and EGR pipe. Neither way is easy or cheap.

[Nafunu32]

I didnt know that for the head porting. I was just looking into new motors... I'll prolly just have everything fixed on my current motor. I don't plan on doing a lot to this car. I would be happy with like 220 hp. Can I get there with a 2.5liter, without F/I of course.

[DanG]

220 crank? Not without headwork. Maybe spray.

220 wheel? You'll need about $15,000 worth of internal work to get it like Capaldi's engine. He was about 325+fwhp N/A 2.5L...

[fordrule]

listen to those guys they help with everyones build. look at other posts in theis section of the recent 3L build ups that were posted up here with pica and all

[Cossack]

do i just need the 3.0L block to do the swap or do i need the whole engine to do it? also are the heads the same on the 2.5l and 3.0l engines?

[Topik]

I also noticed that you are have an auto so set aside about 5k for a manual swap too.




FYI a MTX swap can be done for MUCH less than 5k. Thats if you wanted to do the swap and have the trans Terry hainesalized up and down left and right.

Im almsot done buying parts for my swap and im WELL under 3k.

[Nafunu32]

If I DO decide to keep this car for a while, I may put a manual in it. I think of it this way... get $5000 for my car, save the 3k and 2k from tranny and motor swap, thats already 10,000.... thats a pretty good down payment on the 06 Civic SI I fell in love with. ;)

[BigBalledOX]

3L Cougar > Civic Si.

[Nafunu32]

99 3.0l ATX Cougar > 06 6speed manual Civic SI? It comes stock with 197 hp and only ways 2750lbs...

[BigBalledOX]

Any 3L Cougar > Stock Civic Si.

[XplosivePlushToy]

Haha I am sensing a bias eh? Anyway, Nafanu, I would just advise you to do what I am doing. Find a good place to store parts and just start buying over a lengthy period of time, reading up on your upcoming project as you go. For those of us on a tight budget it is the best bet because, I dont know about you but, after I finish my swap I wont be able to afford something breaking and need to have it all done right the first time. Save up $500 or so and keep it aside just in case a good deal comes along on that block. Go with the oval port 3.0L for reliability reasons. And get in good with blackcoog. Check your area NECO for people doing a swap nearby and if possible, swing by and help em out so you know what to expect and what all has to be done, that way you're ready to do your own (not to mention you now have someone else just as knowledgeable to help you).

[Nafunu32]

I've read, and heard a lot about Cougars being slow... quickness is what im looking for. I don't feel like spending tons of money. I know, HP is expensive, but cougar parts seem to be a little more expensive. I may slowly save up for a 3.0L swap. Which should I do first? Manual or 3.0L swap?

[BigBalledOX]

I've got good basis for my bias :tongue: And when I bring home a dyno plot next Monday my basis will be even more solidified. If you have to choose what to do first, I would suggest the MTX swap. If you're serious about doing this, buy a trashed tranny and send it to Terry Haines for rebuilding, updating, and pretty much bullet proofing. He can also install a limited slip differential, which you will want for your 3L Cougar.

[StealthyWeasel]

subjective. tool, gg

[Nafunu32]

how much is a transmission rebuild and how much would it cost me to have this done? 3000?

[Nafunu32]

other than removing the atx transmission and putting the manual in, what else do u have to do? Add clutch and new shifter? My uncle owns a transmission shop, and this could be a fun project for him.

[fordrule]

to have HMS build u a good tranny it runs ~$2K

[Nafunu32]

Screw that... lol I'll have my uncle build me one for price of parts. lol It doesnt have to be a good one either... not looking to make a 10 second cougar... would a regular mtx and 3.0l I/H/E run like a 14?

[fordrule]

that pice was a flat labor charge of 400 and 70 shipping.

my trany had

hms slick shift forks 200
quaife 598
focus shift tower 200
coated kogbox process 300

ur looking at around ~$1300 in just parts . those parts are the ones i would recommend if someone wanted to run a good 3L and get the power to the ground and also for driveaility.

if ur looking for a cougar to hit the `4 with just a 3L headers, intake adn exhaust. u might want to read some more in the builds. a stock 3L will touch it, but without the proper tuning and prepped drive train and set up on the engine building. it might have difficulties

[Nafunu32]

So its $1300 for the tranny build... what else would I have to get? Clutch and manual stick?

[StealthyWeasel]

(all MTX) to answer your questions, a 3L with ihe can easily be in the 14's. With SVT parts, LSD, and a good tune- low 14's, and if you're god then high 13's. Thats again, very subjective and one dimensional.

[BigBalledOX]

You can hit 14's with a 2.5L in near stock trim.

[fordrule]

You can hit 14's with a 2.5L in near stock trim.


that has a lot to do with driver though and set up.

[StealthyWeasel]

You can hit 14's with a 2.5L in near stock trim.

whats NEAR stock?

[BigBalledOX]

whats NEAR stock?

Ask Kenny. 14.7 at Fest, and I know he doesn't have much work done to his car.

[mond12345]

CougarDB Page (http://www.cougardb.com/car.php?id=Grandmasterkhan)

[fordrule]

Ask Kenny. 14.7 at Fest, and I know he doesn't have much work done to his car.

like i said set up and driver. and btw he has a nicely modded 2.5 . when he gets shis 3L finally done he will be a force to be reckoned with. until then he is just playing catch up lol:cover: ...espically in the corners:cover: :evil:

u know i kid i kid....love u kenny

[BigBalledOX]

Hmm, more done than I remember him telling me. Oh well, it still can be done without an engine swap.

[Nafunu32]

Back to this old forum. Motor is shot and spending a little less than $2500 on a motor. Getting a 3.0l woot! Which is best P&P 2.5 heads or getting a 3.0 intake?

[azbobbybooshay10]

You have to modify quite a few things and you need to pay for a $1000 head porting to keep the stock intake connections. Otherwise if you go with the complete 3L and stick with the 3L upper you need to make a custom fuel rail and EGR pipe.

Either way you're gonna have to modify something. I personally would stick with the 2.5 IM's and get the heads port-matched to fit up with them. If you can find a 04+ Escape 3L, that will help as well. The Taurus doesn't have the right oil pan and pickup, the 04+ Escape does.

To make this as easy as possible, just start reading back thru this forum. I've been looking on and off again since I bought my new Coug in July. I'm just now starting to get a feel for what I'm looking at to do a 3L in my car.

If you go 3L, good luck! You're gonna like it much more than you would a Civic Si (hey, where's the torque?).

[XplosivePlushToy]

Ask Kenny. 14.7 at Fest, and I know he doesn't have much work done to his car.

But it weighs less than a go kart! Then again, weight reduction is an almost free mod (other than the carbon fiber parts and lighter rims).

[Nafunu32]

Yeah, I don't have a lot of time, so I'm confused. Don't know a lot of stuff about this... I cant find an escape motor for less than $1000... I kinda wanna do a full swap, so only thing I have to worry about is changing the fuel rail and egr.

[Blackcoog]

Stick with the full 3L for simplicity. The modifications are straight forward. Basically it's get the connections to fit anyway possible.

[justa2pt5L]

Yeah, I don't have a lot of time, so I'm confused. Don't know a lot of stuff about this... I cant find an escape motor for less than $1000... I kinda wanna do a full swap, so only thing I have to worry about is changing the fuel rail and egr.


I know its on here, but I'll just say it again for those thinking the same thing... car-part.com

I just bought a 01 Escape motor yesterday with 98,000 miles on it for $450.00. I'm going through this motor and building it up so the miles aren't a threat but while searching I found 3 motors 1. 17,000 for $650.00 2. 53,000 for $650.00, and 3. 57,000 for $800.00. All these motors are running still in the car or have been run recently. Most places have some sort of warranty...

When calling around I just mentioned I'm looking for the best price on a ... 2 of the 3 businesses dropped the price like that. #3 above was asking $1,300 on car-part.

Hope this helps

[streetracer8605]

Click on blackcoog's link in his signature. Another person to contact would be jrak123. Imo, I found that getting the 3L heads port matched to the 2.5 intake manifolds was the easiest and best way to go. you wouldn't need to modify the fuel rail, egr, or anything else. If you contact jrak he can get you a pretty decent price on pnp to the 3L heads and will weld them. If you do decide to go that way, make sure you weld the heads. It's worth it to spend a little bit more to have them welded than to risk the engine w/an epoxy. If you wanna know why I recommend this soo much, just take a look for my post on my 3L build in this section. As for a price on the motor, I paid $250 for an engine w/47k miles on it. Keep searching on car-parts.com

Jeff,

[Blackcoog]

Holy old post! Nafunu32 ended up picking a 3L up from me (www.3LDuratec.com (http://www.3LDuratec.com)) early last year.