external wastegate location

[Spe]

This has probably been on here before but, do it again for me..please? I know I saw a picture of a ZX2 guy that had a deltagate and had it mounted right on top of the manifold. That to me looks like it would provide optimal flow. If I could I would like to find that pic, I think I was it on here, but I am not sure. Is the only way to mount an external wastegate is to do it like Afterhours? I saw another guy on the ZX2 forum that had one like that, but it just doesnt look like it would flow that well.

One more SCT question....I know, I know last one I promise...They can just send me a chip for like 200 bucks right? As long as I tell them what I want. I pmed Afterhours about the self tuner...but that is 800 leaves!!! If I can just get them to burn a chip, which I have heard from Tom is really good out of the box, then I will just do that. Thats all Thx

[Afterhours]

I think I know what picture you are talking about. If it's the one I was looking at, it was actually on a Focus......not a ZX2. The Deltagate wastegate was positioned on the turbo manifold right above the #3 cylinder. The flange was welded directly onto the manifold without any type of standoff flange, which made the wastegate stand pretty much.......straight up. The focus has more room between the engine and the hood. That's why you see a few turbo'ed Focus with charge pipes that run over the valve covers. I don't think that would work on the Cougar..........it doesn't have that much clearance.

Technically, you can place an external wastegate just about any place on the turbo manifold and it will work. It's primary purpose is to vent exhaust gases to regulate the amount of boost created by the turbo. With that in mind, there are a few physics considerations that can make one set-up better or worse (performance wise) than another. I guess you could consider these "rules of thumb" rather than absolutes, as they improve performance but are not absolutely necessary.

1) You want to minimize any change in direction that the exhaust gas must flow from the turbo to the vent port of the wastegate.

2) You want to dump the wastegate exhaust flow back into the exhaust system (downpipe) as far away as possible from the turbine exducer.

The rest is a design and clearance considerations.....such as, to minimize the reversal of exhaust gas flow, you want to place the wastegate flange port as close to the turbo flange as possible. Can you accomplish that without running into any clearance issues?.....if you do have clearance issues, what's the best compromise?........etc.

As you can see....much of this is left up to your ingenuity and fabrication abilities.

[Seawulf]

I think the SCT chip is a bit more than $200, but less than $400. The only problem is, it's good but not perfect. The tuner software allows you to fine tune it to get the best power. Granted $800 is a lot, but you can then change the program when ever you want instead of sending the chip back for reprograming. Either way, it's up to you.

http://focus-power.com/images/zeteckit/1_large.jpg
Here's a pic of TurboTom's Focus turbo kit. The wastegate is a Turbonetics DeltaGate II. You sure that wouldn't clear the hood? It barely comes to the top of the valve cover.

[HKSCougar]

SuperChips can custom burn a chip - usually it'll run you about $325 for a single custom tune. You can always get the SCT software later for about $500 bones, but if you're going to do any more tuning on your car in the future, it's worth your while to go ahead and get the SCT package up front. THat way, you can adjust the tune each time you get a new part or upgrade.

[Afterhours]

Originally posted by: Seawulf
Here's a pic of TurboTom's Focus turbo kit. The wastegate is a Turbonetics DeltaGate II. You sure that wouldn't clear the hood? It barely comes to the top of the valve cover.

The Deltagate wastegate is shorter than the Tial wastegate so it may be able to clear the hood. I didn't have one to test fit......so I don't know for sure.

I have both a Cougar and a Focus so I can see the differences in engine compartment space and hood layout. The Cougar's hood is about 8" longer than the Focus. The Focus hood, not only being shorter, but it is racked at a much steeper angle (from the windshield to the front grill). This gives it more underhood clearance than the Cougar. If the Deltagate wastegate can be placed on top of the turbo manifold and be the same height as the valve cover, then it should be ok.

I guess the only way to be sure is to do a test fit.

[Spe]

Thanks Seawulf,that is exactly the pic I was talking about. All are very good answers! I was wondering because, when I went out and looked at the stock exaust manifold, it looked like there was plenty of space before you even reached the top of the vavle covers. We'll see what happens.

Hmmm, tuning,tuning,tuning...how to tune your turbo zetec...sounds like someone should make a book.....

[Spe]

The SCT is the way to go everyone says...ok....Seawulf..."great but not perfect" ok....I am not looking for huge numbers right now. I just want the mutha to run and not cut out one me like I have heard some of them doing on the ZX2's. As long as it runs and I get more power, I'm cool...Then I can opt to get the tuner software once that gets boring......

[Spe]

Well I have been thinking real hard on what type of wastegate to use. I am leaning towards the Tial 38mm(popular). Afterhours, did you even try to mount yours on top? I know that the Tial is about 5in tall plus the flange is about 5.5in. I went out with my trusty tape measure and measured 6in from the top of one of the runners and it comes just to the top of the vavle cover, just shy of where the oval starts on the bottom part of the ford symbol. Looks like it would clear to me. Another reference would be the battery(look across the engine bay from driver side to passenger then visa versa you'll see what I am talking about), it is on the same plane as the 6in measurement and it is located more near the front than the exaust manifold. Hmmm, I wonder...

[Afterhours]

I took another good look and I think it could work. You'd have to weld the wastegate flange directly to the turbo manifold with a very narrow standoff section. But........that may make welding it a little tricky.

Maybe you should cut a 6" piece of 2X4.....then duct tape it to the manifold. That should do ok as a mock-up......close the hood, then look from under the car to see what kind of actual clearance you have. Keep in mind, the effects of engine torque......especially when you're putting out some high torque numbers with the forced induction. personally, I wouldn't be comfortable unless it had about 2 to 3 inches of hood clearance.

Anyway, that's one way you'll know for sure before you drill a hole in the manifold.

[Seawulf]

TurboTom doesn't recommend the Tial. He prefers the Delta II, says the Tial doesn't hold boost as well as the Delta. Since it's also shorter than the Tail, it would fit easier.

[Spe]

ok,then Delta it is, if Tom says so..plus I know it will fit under the hood..thanks