High stall torque converter.

[ZEXCougar]

Can someone help me with an explanation of what a high stall torque converter actually does. I know that it allows you to launch at higher RPMs, but how? Is there any other benefit? Right now I can launch at about 2800 by just holding my foot on the brake without any wheel hopping and very little wheel spin on take off... Taking this into consideration, would I really benefit from the converter? I don't think that I would like to launch any higher than 3000 RPMs, cause I still want to have a little time to hit the nitrous in first gear. How much of difference can I expect with this part installed? And finally, how much does it cost and where can I get it? Thanks for the help on this one... I found many topics about it, but not any that state exactly how it does it's job. Thank you!

[unisys12]

Check this link out... http://auto.howstuffworks.com/torque-converter.htm

As for adding a higher stall convertor to a stock N/A automatic would be a little overkill. It can play a roll in overall performance, but... as a single piece, no real gains are to be had.

We have a member over at CEG that just installed a 3L Hybrid coupled with a 2001 CD4E out of a Couger. He installed a 3000 RPM stall speed convertor, but since he is still in the break-in period he really cannot do any hard launches. He also had the valve body rebuilt with Sonnax values, to add stabilty to the tranny. He is chipped, so his shifts are much firmer then stock.

We are waiiting on a full "report" in a month or so, hopefully after he has had a chance to get his engine tuned.

[coyotefreek]

awsome link, never knew any of that. Now that I know what its about, how much gain do you get with the cougar and how much $$ is it?

[ZEXCougar]

Thanks Unisys12!

[Pyro81]

Wow, now i finally understand how those work. That's an awesome site.

[pgtatx]

Trevor has had that site in his sig for years now...

It is a wonderful site to learn the basics, and look at some cool 3-D animations of things...

I had a 3000 RPM stall TC installed in my Probe, with a recalibrated valvebody. It all worked very well, and yielded some good overall gains. If I hit the gas hard, I could spin my toyo proxes off the line. That was with just basic bolt ons. I never ran it on the track, but my car was definitely closing or even closed the gap between my ATX and the MTX probes.

Anyone from probatalk.com, may remember me as I had the same name there...

[coyotefreek]

Still wondering how much it cost? pgtatx how much did it cost you?

[Jagular]

They are around 400-500 with your converter as a core.

[Russell]

Originally posted by: unisys12
Check this link out... http://auto.howstuffworks.com/torque-converter.htm

As for adding a higher stall convertor to a stock N/A automatic would be a little overkill. It can play a roll in overall performance, but... as a single piece, no real gains are to be had.

We have a member over at CEG that just installed a 3L Hybrid coupled with a 2001 CD4E out of a Couger. He installed a 3000 RPM stall speed convertor, but since he is still in the break-in period he really cannot do any hard launches. He also had the valve body rebuilt with Sonnax values, to add stabilty to the tranny. He is chipped, so his shifts are much firmer then stock.

We are waiiting on a full "report" in a month or so, hopefully after he has had a chance to get his engine tuned.


that would be me :)

accually its a 3500 stall, i can smoke my snow tires into 2nd

id only suggest it if your doing heavy engine mods,a s you gotta pull the engine to replace it

[Raben]

A stall is normally one of the best bang for the bucks performance mods you can do. In my TA it removed 7 tenths of a second off my ET. However I Also changed my gears as well. Stock was a 3.23's and I put in a TCI Superstreet fighter 3500 stall with 3.73 gears and it rocks!

I'm not sure what gear ratio the cougars run but I probably wouldn't go over 2500rpms, just depends where your hp and tq curve is.

My understanding on how a stall works is basically it puts you into your RPM power range right off the line (WOT) and multiplies your torque by 2. What a TCI tech told me over the phone. According to him I should be around ~640ish rwtq off the line however my peak is only 336, and that's because of the stall.

Downside to having a bigger stall is it kills your peak HP. I should be around 350 at the wheels however the higher stall raised my ~ % from 18% to 24% drivetrain loss :( so top end racing, yea my car still pulls strong as hell, but it could be alot more wicked than it is now. But from 0 to 100, it's hang on tight :)



If I was back in the cougar world of things, I would get a 2000 - 2500 stall if there is one, if not remanufactor the stock stall. Throw on headers, off road Y-pipe with heat shields to pass inspection, decent cat-back, CAI with ram air setup, if you can change your gear ratio then go up one step, if not oh well. Find a decent cam and not sure if they have an aftermarket set of heads, if so shell out for that as well. Then a 50 - 75 wet shot of N2O and call it a day :) Oh and dyno tune/chip it as with the headers, cam, heads, etc I am sure will throw off several engine lights :)

But I'm thinking along the lines of what I can do with mine however 3500 stall and up the N2O to 100 - 150 :)



The other thing, same tranny mods however put the 3.0L instead of using the 2.5. Probably get alot better gains that way for the money.

And above all if you do up the stall . . GET A TRANNY COOLER! I've seen a few idiots locally here put on a high stall with no cooler. . then first run down the track. . .snap. Loose a gear or worse, completley muck up the tranny hehehe. I'm running a cooler that's actually alittle big for my application but I'd rather be safe than sorry.

Building up a car to be fast = breaking things unless you do your homework and make sure, ok if I install part A will Part D break? Keep that logic :)


Good luck.

[Raben]

oh and another thing about converters. Alot of people think if they have a 3500 stall, then they can rev the car on up to 3500 and launch hard. That's not always the case. (guess it depends if it's a lockup or nonlockup? can't remember)

However I do know it's based on how strong your brakes are. Holding the brakes on the TA, I can't rev over 1500 to 2000 RPMS before it'll break traction. However as soon as I punch it, it flashes on up to 3500 to 3800 RPMS before you can even blink an eye :)

[Russell]

i need to upgrade my brakes, my car creeps forward when im above 3K

[Russell]

Originally posted by: Raben


My understanding on how a stall works is basically it puts you into your RPM power range right off the line (WOT) and multiplies your torque by 2. What a TCI tech told me over the phone. According to him I should be around ~640ish rwtq off the line however my peak is only 336, and that's because of the stall.

Downside to having a bigger stall is it kills your peak HP. I should be around 350 at the wheels however the higher stall raised my ~ % from 18% to 24% drivetrain loss :( so top end racing, yea my car still pulls strong as hell, but it could be alot more wicked than it is now. But from 0 to 100, it's hang on tight :)




so your saying that i lose HP cause of my convertor but gain torque off the line?

mines just a stock convertor modded for a little higher stall speed.

[Raben]

so your saying that i lose HP cause of my convertor but gain torque off the line?

mines just a stock convertor modded for a little higher stall speed.



Yes you'll loose some hp due to the stall. I went from 316 to 290 at the wheels when I first put them on. With dyno tuning and a few other bolt ons I managed to bring it back up just over 320 but still. However even with the power loss, I dropped nearly 7 tenths of a second off at the 1/4 mile :) So it's well worth it provided you plan to drag race alot. Even mid range it's great. But if you plan to do 70mph rolls you may feel a difference hehe.


Have to dynoed your car before and after tweaking with the stall? If so you should have seen a minor decrease. It wouldnt' be much and tuning could bring it back up somewhat.



And yes a higher stall will double and some will even triple your torque at the wheels out of the hole. Not your peak though. Eventhough peak hp on mine is about 336 to 345 (depending on weather changes, etc as it's never stayed the same at the dyno grr) according to TCI I am pushing ~ 640+ at the wheels in 1st because of the stall. I can feel the differece when I launch as well compared to how it handled stock. I'm slammed against the seat :) But the 600 is a estimate on their behalf. I have no idea how I could test it unless put on a dyno and have then launch it in 1st hehe but then would roast the tires on their dyno hehe.

But it's cool. Stalls are great for automatics if you plan to drag race. :)

and if you haven't see it in another secton of these boards, heres a short vid of my TA, all bolt ons are done except headers from a 20 roll. And you can see where the stall kicked in even from there :)


20 to 100 run (http://mywebpages.comcast.net/dunn37214/run20to100.mpg)